Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
--- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
From: "Ricci, Richard"
To:
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
________________________________
From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
family. -Daniel
_________________________________________________________________
Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
email.
http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
- Log in to post comments
Prefixes
Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often, I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
--- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
From: AliceBB
To:
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
--- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
From: "Ricci, Richard"
To:
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
________________________________
From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
family. -Daniel
_________________________________________________________________
Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
email.
http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
Don y Doña
Alice,
In today's time it's still used, the Don y Doña. In our family it's a form of respect or for the eleders. Don Jose, Doña Maria etc. Now that we are older the younger generation sometimes refers to us as Don Juan or Doña Alicia.
Many people don't use it and some of us who are old fashioned still do.
I suppose that for archival records it was influential people who were addressed in this manner, people with money, those who were in public office and the elders.
Hope this helps,
Alicia,
San Jose, Calif
________________________________
From: AliceBB
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org; alicebb@netscape.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 7:46:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often, I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
--- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
From: AliceBB
To:
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
--- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
From: "Ricci, Richard"
To:
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
________________________________
From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
family. -Daniel
_________________________________________________________________
Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
email.
http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
Don y Doña
Perdón pero estan en un error.
Don y Doña son el trato que reciben aún hoy en día las personas de abolengo sin importar la edad, lo mismo un niño recién nacido que una anciana de 100 años.
El trato de Don y Doña sólo se les dá a personas que pertenecen a la realeza, la alta, media y ba´ja nobleza y a sus descendientes hasta en la tercera generación, a personas que pertenecen a órdenes militares o on cargos en el gobierno real y que el Rey les otorga un escudo de armas.
Esto pasó en el virreinato y aún en el siglo XIX en México y casi toda Latinoamérica.
Los indios nobles también recibian el trato de Don y tenian pribilegios de español como el uso de caballos, casa a la española, uso de armas, caminar por las banquetas, uso de carruajes, etc.
El uso de don y doña se extendió como una manera de respeto o trato especial, de tal modo que hoy en día en México cualquier pelado es Don o Doñita.
Don es la abreviación de 3 palabras. Significa: De Origen Noble. DON.
Para poder usar ese título era necesario ser de origen noble y contar con blasónes o escudo de armas.
Recordemos que los títulos te los dan los demás. Es totalmente incorrecto referirse a uno mismo cono "soy el señor ...." o "atentamente: Don..... ", o "soy el Licenciado fulano de tal" .... eso va contra cualquier protocolo.
En México algunas instituciones sobre todo las religiosas se referían a Don o Doña ya sólo a las personas con poder económico sin importar la genealogía, Don y Doña son títulos para distinguir a la gente entre nobles y plabeyos, en las Repúblicas el uso de los títulos esta prohibido, se cambió por el de Ciudadano.
Espero les haya servido la información.
Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 20:23:59 -0800
> From: alliecar@pacbell.net
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
>
> Alice,
> In today's time it's still used, the Don y Doña. In our family it's a form of respect or for the eleders. Don Jose, Doña Maria etc. Now that we are older the younger generation sometimes refers to us as Don Juan or Doña Alicia.
>
> Many people don't use it and some of us who are old fashioned still do.
> I suppose that for archival records it was influential people who were addressed in this manner, people with money, those who were in public office and the elders.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Calif
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: AliceBB
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org; alicebb@netscape.com
> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 7:46:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
>
> Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often, I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
>
> --- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
>
> From: AliceBB
> To:
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
>
> Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
>
> --- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
>
> From: "Ricci, Richard"
> To:
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
> Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
>
>
>
> That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
> the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
> lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
> trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
> this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
> the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
> write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
>
> On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
> 'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
> betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
> sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
> bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
> history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
> an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
> Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
> his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
> others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
> so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
> were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
> hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
> but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
> the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
> escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
> family. -Daniel
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
> email.
> http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
Don y Doña
Rodolfo,
No dudo que haya cometido un error o muchos errores. Gracias por corregir mis errores. Solo porque nadie le daba respuesta a Alice, me atrevi a dar una respuesta equivocada.
No tengo la menor idea del siginificado de la palabra abolengo, pues sigue mi ignorancia y espero seguir aprendiendo.
Alicia
________________________________
From: Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 3:16:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Perdón pero estan en un error.
Don y Doña son el trato que reciben aún hoy en día las personas de abolengo sin importar la edad, lo mismo un niño recién nacido que una anciana de 100 años.
El trato de Don y Doña sólo se les dá a personas que pertenecen a la realeza, la alta, media y ba´ja nobleza y a sus descendientes hasta en la tercera generación, a personas que pertenecen a órdenes militares o on cargos en el gobierno real y que el Rey les otorga un escudo de armas.
Esto pasó en el virreinato y aún en el siglo XIX en México y casi toda Latinoamérica.
Los indios nobles también recibian el trato de Don y tenian pribilegios de español como el uso de caballos, casa a la española, uso de armas, caminar por las banquetas, uso de carruajes, etc.
El uso de don y doña se extendió como una manera de respeto o trato especial, de tal modo que hoy en día en México cualquier pelado es Don o Doñita.
Don es la abreviación de 3 palabras. Significa: De Origen Noble. DON.
Para poder usar ese título era necesario ser de origen noble y contar con blasónes o escudo de armas.
Recordemos que los títulos te los dan los demás. Es totalmente incorrecto referirse a uno mismo cono "soy el señor ...." o "atentamente: Don..... ", o "soy el Licenciado fulano de tal" .... eso va contra cualquier protocolo.
En México algunas instituciones sobre todo las religiosas se referían a Don o Doña ya sólo a las personas con poder económico sin importar la genealogía, Don y Doña son títulos para distinguir a la gente entre nobles y plabeyos, en las Repúblicas el uso de los títulos esta prohibido, se cambió por el de Ciudadano.
Espero les haya servido la información.
Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 20:23:59 -0800
> From: alliecar@pacbell.net
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
>
> Alice,
> In today's time it's still used, the Don y Doña. In our family it's a form of respect or for the eleders. Don Jose, Doña Maria etc. Now that we are older the younger generation sometimes refers to us as Don Juan or Doña Alicia.
>
> Many people don't use it and some of us who are old fashioned still do.
> I suppose that for archival records it was influential people who were addressed in this manner, people with money, those who were in public office and the elders.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Calif
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: AliceBB
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org; alicebb@netscape.com
> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 7:46:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
>
> Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often, I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
>
> --- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
>
> From: AliceBB
> To:
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
>
> Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
>
> --- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
>
> From: "Ricci, Richard"
> To:
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
> Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
>
>
>
> That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
> the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
> lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
> trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
> this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
> the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
> write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
>
> On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
> 'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
> betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
> sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
> bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
> history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
> an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
> Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
> his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
> others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
> so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
> were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
> hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
> but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
> the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
> escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
> family. -Daniel
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
> email.
> http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
Don y Doña
Alicia abolengo significa descendiente de nobles, personas de antepasados ilustres.
Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:15:57 -0800
> From: alliecar@pacbell.net
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
>
> Rodolfo,
> No dudo que haya cometido un error o muchos errores. Gracias por corregir mis errores. Solo porque nadie le daba respuesta a Alice, me atrevi a dar una respuesta equivocada.
>
> No tengo la menor idea del siginificado de la palabra abolengo, pues sigue mi ignorancia y espero seguir aprendiendo.
>
> Alicia
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 3:16:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
>
>
> Perdón pero estan en un error.
>
>
>
> Don y Doña son el trato que reciben aún hoy en día las personas de abolengo sin importar la edad, lo mismo un niño recién nacido que una anciana de 100 años.
>
> El trato de Don y Doña sólo se les dá a personas que pertenecen a la realeza, la alta, media y ba´ja nobleza y a sus descendientes hasta en la tercera generación, a personas que pertenecen a órdenes militares o on cargos en el gobierno real y que el Rey les otorga un escudo de armas.
>
>
>
> Esto pasó en el virreinato y aún en el siglo XIX en México y casi toda Latinoamérica.
>
>
>
> Los indios nobles también recibian el trato de Don y tenian pribilegios de español como el uso de caballos, casa a la española, uso de armas, caminar por las banquetas, uso de carruajes, etc.
>
>
>
> El uso de don y doña se extendió como una manera de respeto o trato especial, de tal modo que hoy en día en México cualquier pelado es Don o Doñita.
>
>
>
> Don es la abreviación de 3 palabras. Significa: De Origen Noble. DON.
>
>
>
> Para poder usar ese título era necesario ser de origen noble y contar con blasónes o escudo de armas.
>
>
>
> Recordemos que los títulos te los dan los demás. Es totalmente incorrecto referirse a uno mismo cono "soy el señor ...." o "atentamente: Don..... ", o "soy el Licenciado fulano de tal" .... eso va contra cualquier protocolo.
>
>
>
> En México algunas instituciones sobre todo las religiosas se referían a Don o Doña ya sólo a las personas con poder económico sin importar la genealogía, Don y Doña son títulos para distinguir a la gente entre nobles y plabeyos, en las Repúblicas el uso de los títulos esta prohibido, se cambió por el de Ciudadano.
>
>
>
> Espero les haya servido la información.
>
>
>
> Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 20:23:59 -0800
> > From: alliecar@pacbell.net
> > To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
> >
> > Alice,
> > In today's time it's still used, the Don y Doña. In our family it's a form of respect or for the eleders. Don Jose, Doña Maria etc. Now that we are older the younger generation sometimes refers to us as Don Juan or Doña Alicia.
> >
> > Many people don't use it and some of us who are old fashioned still do.
> > I suppose that for archival records it was influential people who were addressed in this manner, people with money, those who were in public office and the elders.
> >
> > Hope this helps,
> > Alicia,
> > San Jose, Calif
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: AliceBB
> > To: general@nuestrosranchos.org; alicebb@netscape.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 7:46:29 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
> >
> > Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often, I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
> >
> > --- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
> >
> > From: AliceBB
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
> > Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
> >
> > Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
> >
> > --- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
> >
> > From: "Ricci, Richard"
> > To:
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
> > Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
> > Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
> > To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
> >
> >
> >
> > That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
> > the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
> > lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
> > trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
> > this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
> > the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
> > write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
> >
> > On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
> > 'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
> > betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
> > sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
> > bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
> > history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
> > an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
> > Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
> > his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
> > others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
> > so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
> > were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
> > hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
> > but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
> > the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
> > escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
> > family. -Daniel
> >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
> > email.
> > http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > general(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > general(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > general(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _____________________________________________________________
> > Netscape. Just the Net You Need.
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > general(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> >
> >
> > _____________________________________________________________
> > Netscape. Just the Net You Need.
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > general(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > general(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Personaliza Messenger como tú quieras.
> http://download.live.com/messenger
Don y Doña
Alicia -
My Spanish dictionary says that "abolengo" means ancestry, lineage, inheritance.
Emilie
----- Original Message -----
From: Alicia Carrillo
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 8:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Rodolfo,
No dudo que haya cometido un error o muchos errores. Gracias por corregir mis errores. Solo porque nadie le daba respuesta a Alice, me atrevi a dar una respuesta equivocada.
No tengo la menor idea del siginificado de la palabra abolengo, pues sigue mi ignorancia y espero seguir aprendiendo.
Alicia
________________________________
From: Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez >
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 3:16:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Perdón pero estan en un error.
Don y Doña son el trato que reciben aún hoy en día las personas de abolengo sin importar la edad, lo mismo un niño recién nacido que una anciana de 100 años.
El trato de Don y Doña sólo se les dá a personas que pertenecen a la realeza, la alta, media y ba´ja nobleza y a sus descendientes hasta en la tercera generación, a personas que pertenecen a órdenes militares o on cargos en el gobierno real y que el Rey les otorga un escudo de armas.
Esto pasó en el virreinato y aún en el siglo XIX en México y casi toda Latinoamérica.
Los indios nobles también recibian el trato de Don y tenian pribilegios de español como el uso de caballos, casa a la española, uso de armas, caminar por las banquetas, uso de carruajes, etc.
El uso de don y doña se extendió como una manera de respeto o trato especial, de tal modo que hoy en día en México cualquier pelado es Don o Doñita.
Don es la abreviación de 3 palabras. Significa: De Origen Noble. DON.
Para poder usar ese título era necesario ser de origen noble y contar con blasónes o escudo de armas.
Recordemos que los títulos te los dan los demás. Es totalmente incorrecto referirse a uno mismo cono "soy el señor ...." o "atentamente: Don..... ", o "soy el Licenciado fulano de tal" .... eso va contra cualquier protocolo.
En México algunas instituciones sobre todo las religiosas se referían a Don o Doña ya sólo a las personas con poder económico sin importar la genealogía, Don y Doña son títulos para distinguir a la gente entre nobles y plabeyos, en las Repúblicas el uso de los títulos esta prohibido, se cambió por el de Ciudadano.
Espero les haya servido la información.
Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 20:23:59 -0800
> From: alliecar@pacbell.net
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
>
> Alice,
> In today's time it's still used, the Don y Doña. In our family it's a form of respect or for the eleders. Don Jose, Doña Maria etc. Now that we are older the younger generation sometimes refers to us as Don Juan or Doña Alicia.
>
> Many people don't use it and some of us who are old fashioned still do.
> I suppose that for archival records it was influential people who were addressed in this manner, people with money, those who were in public office and the elders.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Calif
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: AliceBB >
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org; alicebb@netscape.com
> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 7:46:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
>
> Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often, I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
>
> --- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
>
> From: AliceBB >
> To: >
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
>
> Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
>
> --- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
>
> From: "Ricci, Richard" >
> To: >
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
> Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
>
>
>
> That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
> the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
> lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
> trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
> this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
> the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
> write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
>
> On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
> 'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
> betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
> sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
> bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
> history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
> an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
> Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
> his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
> others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
> so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
> were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
> hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
> but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
> the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
> escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
> family. -Daniel
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
> email.
> http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
Language lesson learned
Thanks Emilie,
Once again, an opportunity to learn something new.
Because I was raised in the USA and did not have a formal education in the Spanish language, there are many words and phrases that I'm unfamiliar with, and all I can do is give it my best.
I believe that because we are a bi-lingual group, it's important for everyone to be patient, supportive and understanding regarding our shortcomings in either language.
Alicia,
San Jose, Calif
________________________________
From: Emilie Garcia
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2009 5:06:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Alicia -
My Spanish dictionary says that "abolengo" means ancestry, lineage, inheritance.
Emilie
----- Original Message -----
From: Alicia Carrillo
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 8:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Rodolfo,
No dudo que haya cometido un error o muchos errores. Gracias por corregir mis errores. Solo porque nadie le daba respuesta a Alice, me atrevi a dar una respuesta equivocada.
No tengo la menor idea del siginificado de la palabra abolengo, pues sigue mi ignorancia y espero seguir aprendiendo.
Alicia
________________________________
From: Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez >
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 3:16:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Perdón pero estan en un error.
Don y Doña son el trato que reciben aún hoy en día las personas de abolengo sin importar la edad, lo mismo un niño recién nacido que una anciana de 100 años.
El trato de Don y Doña sólo se les dá a personas que pertenecen a la realeza, la alta, media y ba´ja nobleza y a sus descendientes hasta en la tercera generación, a personas que pertenecen a órdenes militares o on cargos en el gobierno real y que el Rey les otorga un escudo de armas.
Esto pasó en el virreinato y aún en el siglo XIX en México y casi toda Latinoamérica.
Los indios nobles también recibian el trato de Don y tenian pribilegios de español como el uso de caballos, casa a la española, uso de armas, caminar por las banquetas, uso de carruajes, etc.
El uso de don y doña se extendió como una manera de respeto o trato especial, de tal modo que hoy en día en México cualquier pelado es Don o Doñita.
Don es la abreviación de 3 palabras. Significa: De Origen Noble. DON.
Para poder usar ese título era necesario ser de origen noble y contar con blasónes o escudo de armas.
Recordemos que los títulos te los dan los demás. Es totalmente incorrecto referirse a uno mismo cono "soy el señor ...." o "atentamente: Don..... ", o "soy el Licenciado fulano de tal" .... eso va contra cualquier protocolo.
En México algunas instituciones sobre todo las religiosas se referían a Don o Doña ya sólo a las personas con poder económico sin importar la genealogía, Don y Doña son títulos para distinguir a la gente entre nobles y plabeyos, en las Repúblicas el uso de los títulos esta prohibido, se cambió por el de Ciudadano.
Espero les haya servido la información.
Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 20:23:59 -0800
> From: alliecar@pacbell.net
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
>
> Alice,
> In today's time it's still used, the Don y Doña. In our family it's a form of respect or for the eleders. Don Jose, Doña Maria etc. Now that we are older the younger generation sometimes refers to us as Don Juan or Doña Alicia.
>
> Many people don't use it and some of us who are old fashioned still do.
> I suppose that for archival records it was influential people who were addressed in this manner, people with money, those who were in public office and the elders.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Calif
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: AliceBB >
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org; alicebb@netscape.com
> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 7:46:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
>
> Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often, I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
>
> --- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
>
> From: AliceBB >
> To: >
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
>
> Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
>
> --- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
>
> From: "Ricci, Richard" >
> To: >
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
> Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
>
>
>
> That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
> the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
> lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
> trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
> this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
> the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
> write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
>
> On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
> 'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
> betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
> sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
> bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
> history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
> an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
> Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
> his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
> others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
> so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
> were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
> hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
> but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
> the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
> escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
> family. -Daniel
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
> email.
> http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
Language lesson learned
Alicia,
I ditto that, what a coincidence I 'll be attending a Human Rights Conference in San Jose this coming March 6th.
--- On Sat, 2/28/09, Alicia Carrillo wrote:
From: Alicia Carrillo
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Language lesson learned
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Saturday, February 28, 2009, 8:53 AM
Thanks Emilie,
Once again, an opportunity to learn something new.
Because I was raised in the USA and did not have a formal education in the
Spanish language, there are many words and phrases that I'm unfamiliar with,
and all I can do is give it my best.
I believe that because we are a bi-lingual group, it's important for
everyone to be patient, supportive and understanding regarding our shortcomings
in either language.
Alicia,
San Jose, Calif
________________________________
From: Emilie Garcia
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2009 5:06:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Alicia -
My Spanish dictionary says that "abolengo" means ancestry, lineage,
inheritance.
Emilie
----- Original Message -----
From: Alicia Carrillo
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 8:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Rodolfo,
No dudo que haya cometido un error o muchos errores. Gracias por corregir mis
errores. Solo porque nadie le daba respuesta a Alice, me atrevi a dar una
respuesta equivocada.
No tengo la menor idea del siginificado de la palabra abolengo, pues sigue mi
ignorancia y espero seguir aprendiendo.
Alicia
________________________________
From: Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
>
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 3:16:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
Perdón pero estan en un error.
Don y Doña son el trato que reciben aún hoy en día las personas de
abolengo sin importar la edad, lo mismo un niño recién nacido que una anciana
de 100 años.
El trato de Don y Doña sólo se les dá a personas que pertenecen a la
realeza, la alta, media y ba´ja nobleza y a sus descendientes hasta en la
tercera generación, a personas que pertenecen a órdenes militares o on cargos
en el gobierno real y que el Rey les otorga un escudo de armas.
Esto pasó en el virreinato y aún en el siglo XIX en México y casi toda
Latinoamérica.
Los indios nobles también recibian el trato de Don y tenian pribilegios de
español como el uso de caballos, casa a la española, uso de armas, caminar por
las banquetas, uso de carruajes, etc.
El uso de don y doña se extendió como una manera de respeto o trato
especial, de tal modo que hoy en día en México cualquier pelado es Don o
Doñita.
Don es la abreviación de 3 palabras. Significa: De Origen Noble. DON.
Para poder usar ese título era necesario ser de origen noble y contar con
blasónes o escudo de armas.
Recordemos que los títulos te los dan los demás. Es totalmente incorrecto
referirse a uno mismo cono "soy el señor ...." o
"atentamente: Don..... ", o "soy el Licenciado fulano de
tal" .... eso va contra cualquier protocolo.
En México algunas instituciones sobre todo las religiosas se referían a Don
o Doña ya sólo a las personas con poder económico sin importar la
genealogía, Don y Doña son títulos para distinguir a la gente entre nobles y
plabeyos, en las Repúblicas el uso de los títulos esta prohibido, se cambió
por el de Ciudadano.
Espero les haya servido la información.
Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez
> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 20:23:59 -0800
> From: alliecar@pacbell.net
> To:
general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Don y Doña
>
> Alice,
> In today's time it's still used, the Don y Doña. In our family
it's a form of respect or for the eleders. Don Jose, Doña Maria etc. Now
that we are older the younger generation sometimes refers to us as Don Juan or
Doña Alicia.
>
> Many people don't use it and some of us who are old fashioned still
do.
> I suppose that for archival records it was influential people who were
addressed in this manner, people with money, those who were in public office and
the elders.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Calif
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: AliceBB
>
> To:
general@nuestrosranchos.org;
alicebb@netscape.com
> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 7:46:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
>
> Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the
first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that
someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often,
I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
>
> --- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
>
> From: AliceBB
>
> To:
>
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
>
> Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or
"modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the
"Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
>
> --- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
>
> From: "Ricci, Richard"
>
> To:
>
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From:
general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
on behalf of Marge Vallazza
> Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
> To:
general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
>
>
>
> That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
> the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
> lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege
of
> trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
> this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station,
she's
> the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great
idea to
> write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
>
> On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
> 'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
> betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
> sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its
something really
> bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
> history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
> an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
> Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
> his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And
some
> others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
> so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
> were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
> hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
> but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza"
Everyone knew he was
> the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
> escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
> family. -Daniel
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious
> email.
>
http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_sa…
Prefixes
Alice,
Wikipidia has a good summary of the historical and current usage of Don and Dona n several countries, go to: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_(honorific)
Today, in many Latin American countries the usage is diverse, but most commonly as a sign of respect to elders, clients, or on the basis of socioeconomic or intellectual status. This usage as you will read in Wikipedia, the usage was restricted to nobility. In many records, you will that both male or female would be referred to as Don and Dona, but only when they actually were entitled to the honorific by descent.
Hope this is useful
Jaime
----- Original Message -----
From: "AliceBB"
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org, alicebb@netscape.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2009 9:46:29 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
Hello All, Thought I'd put this out again. I got no response the first time and since I'm relatively new to genealogy, I was hoping that someone could shed some light on this. I come across these prefixes so often, I'd like to know who was entitled to use them. Thanks again, Alice BB
--- alicebb@netscape.com wrote:
From: AliceBB
To:
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Prefixes
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:31:37 -0800
Good Evening Group: Could someone please explain the 19th Century or "modern" criteria as to how one acquired, maintained, or lost the "Don" and/or "Dona" prefix? Thanks so much, Alice BB
--- rricci@lausd.net wrote:
From: "Ricci, Richard"
To:
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:30:49 -0800
________________________________
From: general-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org on behalf of Marge Vallazza
Sent: Mon 2/23/2009 12:53 PM
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Family skeletons
That same sort of stuff is on the Sagrada Mitra book because it's in
the official record, so no big deal in those cases. In those days,
lots of people couldn't read so they didn't have the privelege of
trumpeting all the juicy gossip everywhere. We call one person in
this area around here "Channel 5" because like the tv station, she's
the first in "Breaking News." And I think it would be a great idea to
write the documented stories on NR, if Josef permits. Marge:)
On Feb 22, 2009, at 11:47 PM, Daniel M?ndez del Camino wrote:
Hi Alicia and Richard! I agree with Alicia, I have found out so many
'interesting stories' (scandals, hatred, love stories, murders,
betrayals) Maybe I can post some on Ranchos one day. MY goodness it
sounds like novela on "el catorce." But really if its something really
bad, I still want to know its part of who you are and your family
history. Like one would be my cuarto bisabuelo don Estevan López had
an affair with a younger women Gorgonia de Mendoza and had two kids.
Apparently only some certain confidants he had knew about it, one was
his son-in-law's two brothers Viviano and Manuel del Camino. And some
others. his wife didnot find out until these two kids were about 12 or
so. By then he Estevan had long been dead when his two hijos naturales
were 6 and 7. Lets say Estevan wasnt the faithfulest man on the
hacienda! On there records baptisms ( they have the last name López
but "de padre no conocido" y Gorgonia de Mendoza" Everyone knew he was
the father except his wife and his other family. THe list goes on of
escándolos. Thought I just share this part of Alteño history in my
family. -Daniel
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